[Ground-station] Please vote - Ambasat sensor
Michelle Thompson
mountain.michelle at gmail.com
Sat Sep 28 08:34:34 PDT 2019
That is something that surprised me when the answer was "yes, bring it on"
when I inquired about an amateur payload. This was for the complete custom
board, not this question of "what sensor".
As all of you know, I prefer ground to space, but I know my way around the
issues, and a quick "yes" was, well, eyebrow raising to say the least.
-Michelle W5NYV
On Sat, Sep 28, 2019 at 8:02 AM Thomas Parry via Ground-Station
<ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
> Hey,
>
> There are a lot of interesting things that could be done with a simple
> PLL. You could use it to form a regenerative FMCW ranging radar. This could
> be used to accurately determine the location and speed of the satellite
> from ground. The space segment is as simple as they come, a PLL. This is
> something I would be really interested in implementing if the opportunity
> exists to launch it.
>
> However, I don't think any RF payload would be accepted. The satellite
> frequency filing will be for the specific LoRa frequency, bandwidth and
> modulation. Any added emitters would mean altering the filing and
> reapplying.
>
> Cheers,
> Thomas
>
>
> On Fri, 27 Sep 2019, 13:39 ,
> <ground-station-request at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>
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>> Today's Topics:
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>> 1. Re: Please vote - Ambasat sensor (Michelle Thompson)
>> 2. Re: Please vote - Ambasat sensor (John Ackermann. N8UR)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2019 22:30:39 -0700
>> From: Michelle Thompson <mountain.michelle at gmail.com>
>> To: Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana at gmail.com>
>> Cc: KC9SGV <kc9sgv at gmail.com>, Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station
>> <ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> Subject: Re: [Ground-station] Please vote - Ambasat sensor
>> Message-ID:
>> <CACvjz2WooHZiJLOT=VuqjmRwN=
>> YZJ5UTu35-NOms7NyecSYeGg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> We can design our own sensor. There's a blurb about it on the site and
>> specs for the footprint and interface.
>>
>> If someone commits to build and test, I can work with Ambasat to see if we
>> can get it on there.
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2019, 22:27 Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Rather than a sensor, could we get an ulta stable oscillator (USO) for
>> > some frequency in an amateur satellite band? We would just need the
>> USO, a
>> > small amplifier and an antenna. Even an inefficient antenna. Even if
>> we?re
>> > only radiating a few milliwatts. There?s still a lot of good science we
>> can
>> > do from an unmodulated carrier with Doppler.
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > Douglas
>> >
>> > On Sep 26, 2019, at 6:24 PM, Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> > ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>> >
>> > There are solar panels.
>> >
>> > From https://ambasat.com/ambasat-2/ambasat-1/
>> >
>> > "AmbaSats are just a little bigger than the size of a couple of postage
>> > stamps but have solar cells, a LoRaWAN radio transceiver..."
>> >
>> > For the dashboard, there's a big hint here:
>> > "Your AmbaSat-1 is fully TTN compliant so as well as viewing data in
>> your
>> > Dashboard, you can sign-up for a TTN account and access your satellite?s
>> > sensor data directly using a range of different TTN extensions."
>> >
>> > I think the dashboard is essentially The Things Network. I'll see what I
>> > can find out about the dashboard availability.
>> >
>> > Interesting question about HABs! I think several people on this list are
>> > much more active than I am in designing and building payloads, and
>> might be
>> > able to give an evaluation based on what's on the ambasat.com website.
>> >
>> > -Michelle W5NYV
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Sep 26, 2019 at 11:56 AM KC9SGV <kc9sgv at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> The "three months in space" bit, makes me wonder.
>> >> Maybe out of power by then ?
>> >> (Don't see any solar panels on the board.)
>> >> What would the possibility be to use the board as payload on a HAB
>> (high
>> >> altitude balloon).
>> >> Maybe a Mylar balloon cluster achieving float, like the current Miami
>> >> effort ?
>> >> Then the environmental modules would make sense.
>> >> Could you get the dashboard and web based tracking without buying the
>> >> launch ?
>> >>
>> >> Bernard,
>> >> KC9SGV
>> >> Sent from my iPad
>> >>
>> >> On Sep 26, 2019, at 1:11 PM, Howie DeFelice via Ground-Station <
>> >> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> It has a LoRA radio on board which is really cool. I always thought
>> that
>> >> LoRA on a LEO would make a great Store and Forward messaging sat. The
>> >> chirp spread spectrum modulation handles doppler quite well and LoRA
>> chips
>> >> on carrier boards are easy to find to make ground stations.
>> Unfortunately
>> >> there is little chance we could license it since the FCC decided that
>> >> anything smaller than a 1U cubesat is too small to track.
>> >>
>> >> Howie
>> >> AB2S
>> >> ------------------------------
>> >> *From:* Ground-Station <
>> >> ground-station-bounces at lists.openresearch.institute> on behalf of
>> >> Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> >> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> >> *Sent:* Thursday, September 26, 2019 11:26 AM
>> >> *To:* Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> >> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> >> *Subject:* [Ground-station] Please vote - Ambasat sensor
>> >>
>> >> I bought into the Kickstarter for Ambasat.
>> >> https://ambasat.com/
>> >> <
>> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fambasat.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C2c3f3cef695d4bdb07b208d7429697ee%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637051086889564741&sdata=HQ1maV9Z5PGG%2BUZf%2FqV5zFpH8qsFQ0WDvC4BHQkJ5rE%3D&reserved=0
>> >
>> >>
>> >> I?d like you all to help choose the sensor!
>> >>
>> >> Choices here:
>> >> https://ambasat.com/ambasat-2/sensor-options/
>> >> <
>> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fambasat.com%2Fambasat-2%2Fsensor-options%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C2c3f3cef695d4bdb07b208d7429697ee%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637051086889574740&sdata=0gUbpgbQldmIxAydIuXk6fdBWaQQmBuY8yEH48Rpe64%3D&reserved=0
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Disclaimer:
>> >> This has nothing to do with our project. I acknowledge that Ambasat is
>> >> controversial. No project funds are involved.
>> >>
>> >> Why post this here?
>> >>
>> >> Details:
>> >> I asked Ambasat about a custom amateur radio payload, so we could test
>> >> something for us. The kickstarter had that option. The lead of Ambasat
>> said
>> >> yes, amateur payload ok, several people I asked at Virginia Tech said
>> go
>> >> for it, and a small group looked at the specs and tried to design
>> something
>> >> useful for us. But, the very compact size and power budget was quite
>> >> daunting. And the time frame was very short. We don?t have enough
>> >> miniaturization or time. Instead of a custom board, we have a standard
>> >> flight and a ground version.
>> >>
>> >> Instead of quietly sending this up, I wanted to share it with the team
>> as
>> >> something fun. I just received the survey for the sensors, so we easily
>> >> have a week at least to vote. It includes some sensors already. The
>> free
>> >> choice is an additional sensor slot.
>> >>
>> >> -Michelle W5NYV
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> -Michelle W5NYV
>> >>
>> >> "Potestatem obscuri lateris nescis."
>> >>
>> >>
>> -------------- next part --------------
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: <
>> http://lists.openresearch.institute/pipermail/ground-station/attachments/20190926/83c07ded/attachment-0001.htm
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2019 08:37:23 -0400
>> From: "John Ackermann. N8UR" <jra at febo.com>
>> To: Michelle Thompson <mountain.michelle at gmail.com>
>> Cc: Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana at gmail.com>, Michelle Thompson via
>> Ground-Station <ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> Subject: Re: [Ground-station] Please vote - Ambasat sensor
>> Message-ID: <7ee372f0-165d-4de5-b586-2c568abbe8dd at febo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> In this context, what does "Ultra Stable" mean?? There are a bunch of
>> interesting challenges with crystals in space because of the launch shock,
>> the huge temperature swings, and the thermal insulating properties of
>> vacuum.
>>
>> I know people who know about these things and would be glad to help if we
>> wanted to do this, but a spec is the first requirement.? It would need to
>> include (at a minimum) nominal frequency,? short-term stability, phase
>> noise, drift/aging, temperature response, and absolute frequency accuracy,
>> along with mechanical things like shock rating, physical dimensions, and
>> power budget.? There would have to be consideration of thermal management
>> as well, given the likely need for an oven.
>>
>> (Note: I've never done spacecraft design, but I've picked up on these
>> issues from conversations with those who have worked on space-borne USOs.)
>>
>> 73,
>> John
>>
>> On Sep 27, 2019, 1:32 AM, at 1:32 AM, Michelle Thompson via
>> Ground-Station <ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>> >We can design our own sensor. There's a blurb about it on the site and
>> >specs for the footprint and interface.
>> >
>> >If someone commits to build and test, I can work with Ambasat to see if
>> >we
>> >can get it on there.
>> >
>> >On Thu, Sep 26, 2019, 22:27 Douglas Quagliana <dquagliana at gmail.com>
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >> Rather than a sensor, could we get an ulta stable oscillator (USO)
>> >for
>> >> some frequency in an amateur satellite band? We would just need the
>> >USO, a
>> >> small amplifier and an antenna. Even an inefficient antenna. Even if
>> >we?re
>> >> only radiating a few milliwatts. There?s still a lot of good science
>> >we can
>> >> do from an unmodulated carrier with Doppler.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >> Douglas
>> >>
>> >> On Sep 26, 2019, at 6:24 PM, Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> >> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> There are solar panels.
>> >>
>> >> From https://ambasat.com/ambasat-2/ambasat-1/
>> >>
>> >> "AmbaSats are just a little bigger than the size of a couple of
>> >postage
>> >> stamps but have solar cells, a LoRaWAN radio transceiver..."
>> >>
>> >> For the dashboard, there's a big hint here:
>> >> "Your AmbaSat-1 is fully TTN compliant so as well as viewing data in
>> >your
>> >> Dashboard, you can sign-up for a TTN account and access your
>> >satellite?s
>> >> sensor data directly using a range of different TTN extensions."
>> >>
>> >> I think the dashboard is essentially The Things Network. I'll see
>> >what I
>> >> can find out about the dashboard availability.
>> >>
>> >> Interesting question about HABs! I think several people on this list
>> >are
>> >> much more active than I am in designing and building payloads, and
>> >might be
>> >> able to give an evaluation based on what's on the ambasat.com
>> >website.
>> >>
>> >> -Michelle W5NYV
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Sep 26, 2019 at 11:56 AM KC9SGV <kc9sgv at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> The "three months in space" bit, makes me wonder.
>> >>> Maybe out of power by then ?
>> >>> (Don't see any solar panels on the board.)
>> >>> What would the possibility be to use the board as payload on a HAB
>> >(high
>> >>> altitude balloon).
>> >>> Maybe a Mylar balloon cluster achieving float, like the current
>> >Miami
>> >>> effort ?
>> >>> Then the environmental modules would make sense.
>> >>> Could you get the dashboard and web based tracking without buying
>> >the
>> >>> launch ?
>> >>>
>> >>> Bernard,
>> >>> KC9SGV
>> >>> Sent from my iPad
>> >>>
>> >>> On Sep 26, 2019, at 1:11 PM, Howie DeFelice via Ground-Station <
>> >>> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> It has a LoRA radio on board which is really cool. I always thought
>> >that
>> >>> LoRA on a LEO would make a great Store and Forward messaging sat.
>> >The
>> >>> chirp spread spectrum modulation handles doppler quite well and LoRA
>> >chips
>> >>> on carrier boards are easy to find to make ground stations.
>> >Unfortunately
>> >>> there is little chance we could license it since the FCC decided
>> >that
>> >>> anything smaller than a 1U cubesat is too small to track.
>> >>>
>> >>> Howie
>> >>> AB2S
>> >>> ------------------------------
>> >>> *From:* Ground-Station <
>> >>> ground-station-bounces at lists.openresearch.institute> on behalf of
>> >>> Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> >>> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> >>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 26, 2019 11:26 AM
>> >>> *To:* Michelle Thompson via Ground-Station <
>> >>> ground-station at lists.openresearch.institute>
>> >>> *Subject:* [Ground-station] Please vote - Ambasat sensor
>> >>>
>> >>> I bought into the Kickstarter for Ambasat.
>> >>> https://ambasat.com/
>> >>>
>> ><
>> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fambasat.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C2c3f3cef695d4bdb07b208d7429697ee%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637051086889564741&sdata=HQ1maV9Z5PGG%2BUZf%2FqV5zFpH8qsFQ0WDvC4BHQkJ5rE%3D&reserved=0
>> >
>> >>>
>> >>> I?d like you all to help choose the sensor!
>> >>>
>> >>> Choices here:
>> >>> https://ambasat.com/ambasat-2/sensor-options/
>> >>>
>> ><
>> https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fambasat.com%2Fambasat-2%2Fsensor-options%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C2c3f3cef695d4bdb07b208d7429697ee%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637051086889574740&sdata=0gUbpgbQldmIxAydIuXk6fdBWaQQmBuY8yEH48Rpe64%3D&reserved=0
>> >
>> >>>
>> >>> Disclaimer:
>> >>> This has nothing to do with our project. I acknowledge that Ambasat
>> >is
>> >>> controversial. No project funds are involved.
>> >>>
>> >>> Why post this here?
>> >>>
>> >>> Details:
>> >>> I asked Ambasat about a custom amateur radio payload, so we could
>> >test
>> >>> something for us. The kickstarter had that option. The lead of
>> >Ambasat said
>> >>> yes, amateur payload ok, several people I asked at Virginia Tech
>> >said go
>> >>> for it, and a small group looked at the specs and tried to design
>> >something
>> >>> useful for us. But, the very compact size and power budget was quite
>> >>> daunting. And the time frame was very short. We don?t have enough
>> >>> miniaturization or time. Instead of a custom board, we have a
>> >standard
>> >>> flight and a ground version.
>> >>>
>> >>> Instead of quietly sending this up, I wanted to share it with the
>> >team as
>> >>> something fun. I just received the survey for the sensors, so we
>> >easily
>> >>> have a week at least to vote. It includes some sensors already. The
>> >free
>> >>> choice is an additional sensor slot.
>> >>>
>> >>> -Michelle W5NYV
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> -Michelle W5NYV
>> >>>
>> >>> "Potestatem obscuri lateris nescis."
>> >>>
>> >>>
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